The Exchange: Episode 17 - Customer Training Part 1

Season 2 Episode 6 is the first of 2 parts on the topic of customer training. As Todd says, for coffee roasters, "training is the new equipment." But how much training, where, and when? Is it free? How do you manage customer expectations? Not only do Mark and Todd begin addressing these questions, but Todd was late for our recording sessions and, of course, Mark just let that go and didn't mention it ... at all.

Available on iTunes and Full Transcript Below

Mike: Just when you thought it was safe to go back in the water, here you are listening to Episode 6, Season two of The Exchange, presented by Olam Specialty Coffee, hosted by Mark Inman and Todd Mackey. I'm Mike Ferguson. This is our 17th podcast, and the topic is the coffee roaster and customer training. Fortunately, that's exactly what Mark and Todd talk about. It is a two part episode because, well, we just can't help ourselves. And now here they are. Mark and Todd.

Mark: Welcome to The Exchange, presented by Olam Specialty Coffee. I'm your host, Mark Inman. And with me is our producer, Mike Ferguson, and my co-host, Todd Hollywood Mackey. Todd, you know where I'm going with this already, so... I can hear it. What happened?

Todd: Mark, we have to go in this early. I was late to the recording session.

Mark: Yes, 30 minutes late. Mr. Hollywood was out signing autographs from wooing fans.

Todd: I wish I could say that the path between my car door and my seat here at the desk was crowded and just a dire scene, just trying to make my way. Clearly, it's not. I'll never live this down.

Mark: I saw your trending on Twitter right now.

Todd: All I can do is apologize to you and our listeners. Mike, of course. Forgive me. I feel as though things might be a little rocky, and I hope that I can win your good faith back by the end of the episode, for our bright future ahead.

Mark: And if you did get a, were lucky enough to get a photograph of Todd making his way to the studio tonight, please send it to us using the #WalkofFame. And we will post those photographs of Todd, you know, being out in the real world on our Web page or Twitter. What do we have? I don't know what we have. Mr. Ferguson knows. But we'll post it somewhere. If you've got that glimpse of Todd tonight, one of the lucky ones.

Todd: I can already hear Mike like feverishly clicking his mouse.

Mark: Creating a Twitter account.

Todd: Yeah, that's awesome. Well, it's great to be back. We have a very cool episode in the mix. Probably most likely a double episode that we're gonna be working on here in season two... The coffee roaster and customer training, which is for sure, obviously a key consideration given the nature of the market and where things have gone in the last five to eight years, but also something of a focus for me over the course of my career and the different roles, training wise, that I've played, including the sort of advent of my role here at Olam Specialty. So I'm super excited to get into this. But before we move any further, and and without chastising me and my late self anymore... What's in your glass, Mark?

Mark: Well, what's in my glass, Todd, is nothing, because I drank it all waiting for you. It was really delicious. We actually made this at a company retreat. We picked a ton of sera grapes, and this was two years ago, we picked the grapes, we crushed them, we fermented it, barreled it, and we bottled it just two weeks ago. So this is our Olam Sera. So I'm half in the bag at this point because I was waiting for you so long. I just kept going and going.

Todd: Oh come on. Boooo. Did it taste like Ian's feet like on a late September day?

Mark: No. It actually came out outstanding for a... Well for one, we started with really good grapes. I mean, the vineyard that we went to was top notch, and I think it had a bit of everyone's feet in there. But that doesn't really make a difference once you get into fermentation. But I think there's a case or two coming your guys way, but it is well worth drinking. So very nice wine.

Todd: I sure hope so. Yeah, I was gonna say, I mean we have, and we've certainly had the rosé from the same...

Mark: Yeah. We made a rosé and straight sera.

Todd: Yeah. Yeah. No that's exciting because the rosé was punchy and interesting, but like tasted to me a bit unhinged.

Mark: Yeah.

Todd: It'll be exciting to taste the full red. And yeah I just hope some turns up. I mean obviously we're in danger, given your review here that maybe that won't make it out.

Mark: Well, we've got like 63 cases, so I would venture to say we have plenty to send out to you.

Todd: Holy hell. Really? We made that much wine?

Mark: Oh yeah. A barrel makes quite a bit. We even bottled and magnums, too. We've got large format wines this year.

Todd: All right. I'll take a case of those.

Mark: So how about you? What's in your cup tonight there?

Todd: I yet again, I am working from a can, but I have something like that's pretty primo here. I mean, any beer drinker who's a fan of BeerAdvocate or, you know, in the scene, as they say, in particular, the New England scene, will, I hope at least would have heard of this beer. It's from Tree House, which is, of course, a well-known... But I am drinking a can of their beloved short run American Double IPA Juice Machine.

Mark: Wow. What a name.

Todd: This... Yeah, it's quite a name. It's a fairly mysterious hop schedule on top of a you know, a powerful malt bill. It's 8.2% ABV...just an absolute panopoly of fruit, and it is juicy. I mean, what can I say? It's not really nice. So I'm working on that. We're amidst a heat wave out here in the northeast. And so, yeah, the can is sweating. I'm super appreciative to have it by my side, especially coming in with so much pressure and disdain from not only you, but from our producer, Mike. But, yeah. Let's move on to the to the meat of the episode and get into it. I'll kick it over to you. I feel like I owe you this, having kept you waiting. How do you want to start the discussion off...the coffee roaster and customer training?

Mark: Well, look, I know we both have work in this field. I haven't done the training piece in a handful of years. And I know last episode I talked, I think Mr. Ferguson dropped it on the end of the episode, about how I met with Rex Tillerson to talk about the subject of our last show. So I had breakfast this morning with a handful of people who are experts in the field of training in coffee. So...

Todd: Oh yeah, who's that? {laughter}

Mark: Zev Siegl, the founder of Starbucks... Hiromichi Toriba, from Doutor Coffee in Japan... And then was lucky enough to run into Paul Bassett as I was paying my check. So, he sat down and gave me a couple of tips. So I'm pretty much locked and loaded for this episode. And I know that you're coming in hot because you've been doing this for a while. But I got a few surprises for you tonight, my friend, don't you worry.

Todd: Well, hey, kick us off. So like zooming out. Let's shape it up from 30,000 feet.

Mark: Yeah.

Todd: Give me your three to four top questions or concerns that you would hit any growing roaster with as it pertains to customer training, whether that's like program perspective or what have you. I have a handful of like main bullets, and then we'll cut it up and we'll move the discussion from there.

Mark: Well, I think the main points that I would would bring in early would be knowing who you're training. I think the biggest mistake that roasters make is they try to lump all of their wholesale clients into a group training session, and the type of training that you would offer somebody who owns a restaurant is going to be very different than somebody who owns an actual coffee house or a bakery because the type of service you'd be doing, the type of training you'd be doing is a totally different focus. Secondly, I would say having your programs very well thought out and simplified, cleaned up, you know, edited. Nobody is going to sit through a training that is overly wonky and too overly detailed. Have it very, very streamlined. And then later on, you know, get into it about the idea of do you charge for these things? Do you offer it for free? And the type of staffing that you throw towards a training program.

Todd: Sure. OK. Cool. Yeah. So we're fairly well overlapped. I think I certainly have the, I call it treatment or the communication style.

Mark: Sure.

Todd: You know, are you overly stuffy and technical? That sort of lab approach versus informal and just more practical? You know, I have certainly the distribution mechanism... Is at a training center? Are you out and about? Obviously, again, to follow up with you, you have different types of clients with different needs.

Mark: Yeah.

Todd: I have two that sort of take I think your third and run, but I might kind of vary this a little bit. One I have is, you know, standards, your development, whether that's something that is industry correlating or sort of unique to yourself. And there's a lot of different examples out there in the marketplace that we talk about. And then, of course, a very critical piece. And this one I'm personally super passionate about, having been a trainer in a number of different capacities, starting at the roaster level and in the roasting space, is team structure and how you approach the part of your team, or parts of your team, and how they approach each other to create a successful training program, because that is a high value, high demand part of the business. And I think unfortunately, to their own detriment, a lot of roasters don't necessarily look at this as critical as it is when it comes to what type of value they put on these roles, what type of support they deliver and...

Mark: Do you think that roasters still believe that today? I mean, it's gotten very competitive out there. It seems like that's the one thing you have to do now, it's become your baseline, is a very strong training program.

Todd: Of course. Yeah. And let's start there. So let's talk about the team structure, or the role of the trainer. You know, in my mind, this is a part of your generative business team, your sales team, your out front lines. I think this entered as a, you have your salespeople who are closing sales, and then you hand them off to account managers and/or customer trainers. And this took like a secondary stage. I'm not arguing that roasters don't put enough value on having the trainer. What I'm trying to suggest is that I don't think a lot of people really recognize and then compensate for just how tiresome this role is.

Mark: Oh, yeah.

Todd: Going back to when I was training for a roaster. I mean, this was one of the most demanding jobs in terms of preparation. Right? Just like you brought up at the gate, you can not go into a customer's cafe or any training lab with a variety of folks, you can't sell a course in the space this day and age, without being well-prepared, have stylized and branded resources, you know, have a backed up position on your brewing techniques and standards... I mean, there's a lot of development and research and development, you could say, that goes into this. But there's also a huge amount of fatigue in setting the space, administering the classes that demand on communication, the emotional labor involved in trying to tickle every attendee who's there. And then add to that, that when you are doing this as a wholesale trainer, you have this added piece of, what is most typically, at least in my experience, and certainly I think it hopefully has gotten better for people who are operating in this space, but you have plenty of people who are mandated to be there. They have to go. It's part of their training as they take on a job. They may take this seriously or not. You have the objective of increasing the quality of the coffee for your employer, and you have your different success metrics, whether defined or not, often less than defined. And you're going out and you're being forced to kind of engage and excite this really varied and sort of like loosely held together audience, and it just it's exhausting and challenging and you're doing a fantastic amount of physical setup and then cleanup and breakdown. And it's just, it's a role that I feel like gets very little recognition for those aspects. And then on top of it, it becomes one of those things... Think of a great example of a coffee company with a world class training program is Counter Culture, right?

Mark: Right.

Todd: But think of the amount of inputs that our going into one of their training centers for the calendar they're keeping each week. I mean, it's unbelievable. And so in my opinion, you know, those roles should be absolutely at the top end of their compensation structures and benefits for how they're engaging their markets around sales, because this is just a huge and critical engagement piece that keeps their customers coming back.

Mark: Right. Right.

Todd: You know, and again, to reduce it to four words... "High value, high fatigue." This is something that I think a lot of companies have to think proactively about. "Well, how do we literally monetize this for our trainers?" And then also, "How do we keep them feeling excited and engaged when a significant percentage often of their audience is not necessarily as high on what they're putting out there as they are?" You know?

Mark: Yeah. But I do think that when I was doing trainings back in the day, it was something that you were like trying to get the account to do to learn how to do these things. It was feeling like more of a "I'm trying... I'm begging you to pick up my standards." And I think that today, the training program, I think that two things should be going on. One is it's a real opportunity for a coffee company that is adequately resourced, because this is not a cheap thing to get into. It's something that could set your brand apart from everybody around you by the quality of training or the attention to detail that you are insisting upon. And I think it's... I thought about, you know, a Blue Bottle, here in the Bay Area, when they were first starting. They had all these demands on a wholesale client. You had to use this type of espresso machine. You had to brew using their pour over brewer. You had to complete training before they'd even sell you a pound of coffee. It actually establishes a standard that the account then, the dynamic shifts to, "I need to learn this because I want to have this brand." It's like bars that used to serve Guinness. You had to go through so much technical training to pour the Guinness correctly or they would not sell you the kegs of beer. Now, I don't know if that's still going on. This is just something that I knew existed. I think it's an opportunity to really set the bar high. Have a consistent training program. And now, have you seen out there, Todd, the master class, you know, these online courses, you could... Thomas Keller and and various directors, you could listen to their theory on how they do what they do. Coffee is not that far from doing a thing like that. But I think you can really go very, very high concept with this if you have somebody good and monetize it. And it's not... I think the shift that needs to happen is we're not giving you this for free. This costs money, but this is something that is going to separate your business or make your coffee program a success or a failure. And if it's a failure, we want nothing to do with you. And it puts the customer in a very different position than, "Hey, you know, we've got these trainings if you guys want to take advantage of them." Because then that's like a throwaway, and they put as much energy into it as you did pitching it, which is this after thought and kind of a plea to, you know, please participate to not make us look terrible when you guys are brewing our product.

Todd: Totally. Yeah. And I think this gets into how you distribute, how you opt to distribute.

Mark: Yeah.

Todd: The whole if/then question is huge.

Mark: Right.

Todd: "You need to take this course to get our coffee. This is a requirement for your key team members" or "We have to graduate your bar manager by such and such a timeframe to set up as an account."

Mark: Or even certify. "You need to be certified to serve our product.".

Todd: Totally. But in that case, I mean, this gets back to the question we raise about standards. Do you correlate to SCA standards and best practices from an industry standpoint? Are you more, let's say, focused on your own best practices, for example, setting your recipes, and communicating essentially, in more direct ways, how to brew a particular coffee?

Mark: Right.

Todd: You know, think of the famous espresso blends for some of the bigger specialty roasters... "Hey, this is how this particular coffee is best presented." Those things need to be defined and they need to be codified. And for sure, if you're going to be putting out a high program that you're demanding is attended and engaged, this better be a program that, first and foremost, speaks to different types of learners. Audio learners, visual learners, kinetic learners. These are all considerations. Any trainer who's thinking big picture is going to be thinking not only, you know, the old saying teachers teach how they learn, right? If I learn visually, I'm going to load packets full of pictures, maybe use AV and, you know, be acting with my hands, and doing this whole thing. Well, you know, if you're a good trainer, a trainer whose worth their salt, they're going to be thinking practically and how to engage learners of all types. And they should be.

Mark: Right.

Todd: But the other question around team, just to not get off this main point too soon, comes into how do you create cohesion in a team? And when you start talking about companies that are growing and having to serve a large and diversified wholesale base and/or companies that have outposts in different cities, in different submarkets, there has to be some type of clear hierarchical, for lack of a better concept, chain of command around, "Well, who's right? Right?

Mark: Right.

Todd: We always joke in the Q program as instructors, "Well, eventually someone just has to be right." And in the case of the Q, the instructor gets to say, "Well, this is where we land together.".

Mark: Right.

Todd: And in the case of a training program, there needs to be... It can't just be, "Well, today, this coffee tasted great at this ratio, and so if I were there, I can change things to brew, X, Y, Z, willy nilly of any protocol." And I think the companies that are most successful, they have distilled their programs into physical resources and set, regularly revised programs and actual resources, manuals, teaching materials, et cetera. But they're also able to create cohesion across multiple locations, whether that's out in the field at different customers and/or in different teaching labs by having this type of cooperation amongst their team. It's not just, "Hey, I'm a great basketball player, I'm just going to show up and shoot the ball. And you take a look at what I'm doing.".

Mark: Right.

Todd: It's you know, "We believe that coffee, and our coffees more particularly, are best brewed this way, and here is how to do it." That way, they essentially are able to create a real point of view, and in particular for their brand everywhere that it's seen, which is, again I always default when it comes to customer training to Counter Culture because they've just done such an awesome job in such a widespread way not to only pass along praise and respect their there. There's a number of great examples.

Mark: Sure. Oh, yeah.

Todd: But to shift gears, we get into, and we're sort of already just by engaging this whole kind of wider team approach and talking about some of the aspects of the challenges of training as a team. And we've talked about distribution. And I think that one of the biggest macro questions is, are you doing this onsite at your grocery and your own training center? Or are you going to your customers and essentially trying to like get the attention of their staff while they're also engaging their customers, which if you've spent time as a trainer who has ever had to do this, it is the worst type of work.

Mark: Yeah.

Todd: I mean, you are in your own personal hell trying to get it done. So maybe you could wrap a little bit on the benefits of training centers or the lab approach and how you looked at it when you were in the wholesale roasting space.

Mark: Yeah. I mean, we did a training center because we sold specific equipment that we used with our coffees and our customers used. So it was the same equipment that they would have in their establishment. So if they were brewing, they used the FETCO brewers. If they were doing, you know, espresso training, they would be on Nuova Simonellis. And on down the line. So there was nothing different there. The only time we did stuff different was when Clover wanted to do a demo for Northern California, and we offered up our lab to do it. That was an experience to look at the piece of equipment that most people had only heard about and had the opportunity to go through a training, but that was not a part of our normal training program. We certainly in the early days went in to customers' establishments and tried to do training, and like you said, it is an utter nightmare to try to do that. If it's during work hours, it's horrible. If it's off hours, the staff cannot wait to get out of there. They don't want to be there because it's, you know, they're on the clock, but they're done for the day mentally. And they don't want to sit there and steam milk for two hours and, you know, brew batch after batch after batch. They just don't want to do it. So I always, when I had the resources to do so, I built a, you know, at first a small training room in our building and then it expanded. And especially when we started selling equipment, we would have an array of our product line of what we were both selling to customers as well as placing when one that was going on in our area, placing equipment. It was that type of you know, they would know the equipment they were using. And I'm a large fan of that. I do think the challenge there becomes when you have a company, again, like Counter Culture who started expanding, or Batdorf and Bronson, who went from Olympia, Washington down to Atlanta, all of a sudden you have to build a second center, a second roastery. All of a sudden this gets to be very expensive to continue to do this as your company expands. I think of Intelligentsia the same way. They went from Chicago to L.A. then New York. And now you're managing this network of training centers, and you can't exactly use the same trainer for each center because you have simultaneous trainings going on. So you have to hire more staff that are qualified teachers. You just can't have like you said earlier, just because you're a barista doesn't mean you know how to teach and doesn't mean you know how to impart what you know onto somebody who doesn't know this stuff? So you have to really vet these trainers. And in my, you know, what I would have done if I had the company, was hire talent, like real talent. Somebody who had won the Brewers Championship, The Brewers Cup, or somebody who had won the World Barista Championship. Then when you're charging for these programs, people are coming there to see a name that they know, or a name they understand. There is an ability to monetize this that makes it worthwhile for the trainer that you're hiring, and makes it worthwhile for the client who feels like they're getting an incredible value for their money to learn from somebody who's deemed to be the best in the industry at that given time.

Todd: True. True. Yeah. I think it brings us into the question of how do you best monetize this? Or what are the options? I guess we could say.

Mark: Yeah.

Todd: You see different folks playing to different ends where some of the companies are doing enough direct to consumer business where there are trainings that mimic their wholesale training offerings that are sold through Web registration for regular classes. This might even be something that is billed out to a wholesale customer and maybe netted to zero on any given invoice. Maybe it's a credit back or some sort of allowance, like you said earlier, to keep the account in good standing. I guess I'm curious, you know, from your experience, what have you seen and what do you think are the strongest ways to communicate that value to the customer? Because I think still the expectation for most bigger accounts is that training is a value add.

Mark: Right.

Todd: We always joke out this way because, you know, old school coffee, pre third wave specialty, it was assumed that you got free equipment with your wholesale roasted coffee.

Mark: And it's still a case in many markets out there.

Todd: For sure. But we always joke, and specialty training is the new equipment right? Where most people think, "Well, I'm going to have to buy a nice LaMarzoco machine. I might get a deal," but in general, the training is the value at "Hey, well, you know, we have so-and-so who is a celebrated and decorated barista who's going to come in and train you," or "We have this program that's built on X, Y and Z standardized brewing methodology. And we're going to come in and support you in this way, because maybe this is not something you're as comfortable with as an owner operator in imparting into your team." I guess I'm curious, what ways have you seen this value communicated? Because at the end of the day, most roasters still are not expecting their primary wholesale customers to actually be cutting a check for these classes. Right? How have you seen this communicated out to them to where they can take advantage of it, and their team isn't just not showing? Because again, I've lived that life as a trainer.

Mark: Sure.

Todd: And I cannot communicate how disappointing it feels, even if your own company is valuing you and taking care of you, so on and so forth. There is just no feeling worse than, "Oh, hey my two o'clock didn't show up." Yes. Don't tie this back to me being late to the episode tonight.

Mark: {laughter} No. Well, you know, I think that yeah, I think that when you do free training, you get the value of that is as much as you're charging, which is zero. It's the same thing with giving away free equipment. The customer never values that equipment, and they abuse it. They don't maintain it because they think, "I'll just get another free one. It will just keep coming." And it's when you shift that. I mean, the only way I can compare it is that, in the Bay Area here in San Francisco, it was, "Hey, you know, we want to be your wholesaler." "OK? What do you got?" "We're going to give you a brewer, a grinder." "OK. But the competitors offered me a free espresso machine." I mean, then you start doing the math. I go, that doesn't make any sense. It doesn't pencil out. And everybody was ratcheting up the free equipment, but it was never good equipment. And the customer never took care of it. And then we, to get out of that, we basically sat down with the customer and did the math. I'm charging you X amount of dollars for wholesale. I can charge you this much less, because if I have to buy an espresso machine by a grinder, you know, buy this to give you for free. Then I have to make up for that. This is a business at the end of the day, I'm not a charity or I'm not an NGO.

Todd: Yeah. There is no free lunch.

Mark: Right. So it was I'll reduce your wholesale costs, but you'll buy this equipment and we'll train you how to use it properly. But it's good equipment and your staff will want to do well with. And then that shifted the value proposition. Now, I think who has been successful at doing this is a company like Intelligentsia who had a world champion baristas, and it was more, "You're lucky to even get the opportunity to be be trained here." You're not gonna be late, and you're not going to not show because you will never be allowed to grace these doors again. And they did not have that problem. People were lining up to take their trainings, and their wholesale program was very vibrant back in the day. And I think it's because they invested a lot in talent. And that talent was known industry wide. It wasn't just, you know, they were the big fish in the small pond of their market. They were known internationally. So it's the... And the investment paid off for them. Now, I don't know if they ever charged for this training. I don't know that. My assumption is, is that they did because the quality of the training was quite good. The people that were in charge of the training program when I was aware of them, watching them closely, you know, these people were also instructors in the SCAA at the time. And they were you know, they were practicing their chops through the SCAA on instructing that they were taking back to their own company, and their investment in their training centers were top notch. I mean, it looked like a functioning cafe when you went into these training centers. And a lot of investment went into that, but it worked for them. Now, I think if you're smaller roster, and you don't have the budget, you're not going to be able to compete at that high of a level. But then make your actual coffee program mirror what you have the money to do. So, you know, a prime example of that was, I personally, even though I was the chair of The World Barista Championship, I was not altogether sold on the idea that everybody needed an espresso machine in their establishment, especially restaurants. Because the argument that I would have made at the time is that there are a lot of coffee houses in any given town at this point. I mean, Providence, for example, where you are. How good, when you go to a restaurant, non Italian, let's just say you go to a regular old restaurant, and they have an espresso machine, how good do you think that drink is going to be at that establishment? Probably not very good. And meanwhile, next door, you're gonna get a fantastic espresso or cappuccino because that's their focus. That's what they do great. So what I would argue, at the time what I was pushing to restaurants, because A) I didn't want to get that deep into espresso and B) I didn't have a great trainer at the time, was here in Sonoma County with the wines and seasonal food and seasonal eating, was offer a seasonal table side French press menu. You can never go wrong. Nobody's going to ever get up and walk out because they can't get a cappuccino if that's being offered. You can rotate the coffee so they're always in season. You could tell the same story about that coffee that you're telling about your wines on your wine list or whatever other top end rums or beers that you're selling, or whatever you're into. You can have the same story for your waiters. It's easy to do. It's easy to do correctly. And it is a good profit center, whereas, you know, an espresso machine for a restaurant. It's, you know, an espresso machine, a grinder the tamper, the knock box... All of a sudden, you've got six feet of dedicated counter space just to serve a cup of coffee versus a hot water tower, a grinder, and some French presses. And you're good to go with a very good program if you teach them right. Or Chemex, or whatever you want to do. So I was pushing that, and we were able to train around that seasonally throughout the year. Now we're dealing with centrals, and this is our brewing parameters when we deal with these coffees. And they were mirroring the, you know, the Gold Cup standard, but it was still changing the brewing parameters for the time of the year. It was easy to train it. It was easy to standardize it. It was easy for the staff to understand and grasp it and feel successful at it. Therefore, it was a successful training program versus my early espresso training programs were a nightmare. I mean, I had to call in Ellie Hudson to come help us because I was like, look, I'm drowning over here. I need need some help. And she was able to help me craft a very good program. But at that time, I still predominately was dealing with restaurants here in the wine country and bakeries, and espresso was deemed as what you had to have. But I was on a mission to talk people out of it and getting into the idea of the myriad of great flavor opportunities that were there for brewed coffee.

Mike: You've been listening to The Exchange, presented by Olam Specialty Coffee, hosted by Mark Goodman and Todd Mackey, directed by Mike Ferguson. Our opening theme, Hospital Coffee by the Wound. Our closing theme is Grinder by SJ Mallya. Remember, you can e-mail us at theexchange@olamnet.com. Thanks for listening. And we'll see you in two weeks for part two of the roaster and customer training. And now your postscript.

Mark: Oh, oh, oh. Deuce Bigelow... Rob Schneider. Yeah.